Proposing account limitations and bosskill caps for a healthier server economy

[Mark Rutte]

Dear Community,

I've been observing our server's recent activities and I have a few suggestions to improve the overall player experience and the health of our economy.

Currently, our server sees an average of 8-16 active players online, excluding alts. Given our current player population, it seems to be more beneficial for the majority if we limit gameplay to one account per player. This approach would stimulate our economy to having to buy supplies, rather than having a single player operate multiple accounts and playing like a ironman on two accounts.

By restricting to a single account, we would ensure a more balanced distribution of resources and also create a more welcoming environment for our new players. At present, the dominance of multiple-account players at bosses, often with better gear on their alts than a new player could acquire in a week, can be disheartening for newcomers. In fact, I've witnessed two of my friends leave the server due to this issue, with being @DeMol27 the last one.

Additionally, I'd like to express my concern about the rapid accumulation of high-level gear in our server, which is not even two weeks old. For instance, @SuggySean has already acquired four SS, and I myself have max melee gear. If this trend continues, we may find ourselves handing out full skeleton sets to new players in a couple of weeks.

To address this, I propose implementing a daily cap on bosskills. This would ensure a fair opportunity for all players to participate, and slow down the rapid inflation of high-tier items by one player. As our player base grows, we can reassess and potentially lift these restrictions.

In summary, limiting the number of accounts per player and capping daily bosskills could help us foster a more balanced game economy and a more welcoming environment for new players. I look forward to hearing your thoughts on these proposals.

Have a great day guys!

 

[The Economy]

Yeah. No. Overkill

 

[Abzulah]

All up for it, problem is that the underlying issue of no money flow in pvm is the main issue. I can vote on this but I'd much rather have alchable drops from higher end content to raise money in the economy and work on the supplies in game. That's the main issue here, so that the meta isn't getting a random ass whip early game and dominate the game till content dries out.

I think we should open a poll instead and focus primarly on balancing the economy before anything else. we need more items dropped on monsters, because we don't have enough players willing to primarly gather right now.

Thoughts?

 

[The Kraken]

Again, the issue is you are playing a 300+ player designed server with about 20 people.

The entire server needs to be redone to keep the dodian feel, but at the same time adjust to the lower playerbase.

How is this done?

Make all drops more rare by at least 400%.

Make GP the main currency (add a trading post ingame).

The issue is, it's already too late to implement this and "fix" the server. As you said yourself. The server is two weeks in and you have max melee, there are multiple sets of max melee gear ingame. If this is increased, no players will never have a chance. Last time I proposed a reset I was laughed at, but unfortunetly there is no other way.

 

[Luma]

Definitely don't agree with one account limitation. Just too boring. Two seems fine and always has been fine.

Also big no on the boss kill cap.

 

[Saragoth]

Again, the issue is you are playing a 300+ player designed server with about 20 people.

The entire server needs to be redone to keep the dodian feel, but at the same time adjust to the lower playerbase.

How is this done?

Make all drops more rare by at least 400%.

Make GP the main currency (add a trading post ingame).

The issue is, it's already too late to implement this and "fix" the server. As you said yourself. The server is two weeks in and you have max melee, there are multiple sets of max melee gear ingame. If this is increased, no players will never have a chance. Last time I proposed a reset I was laughed at, but unfortunetly there is no other way.

I appreciate you trying to rewrite the story on the reset discussion. The reality is that you were 'laughed at' because you wanted a reset strictly due to the power of magic over the first couple days of the server, not because of anything being discussed in this thread, nor any point that you just brought up. Lowering the drop rate was the root cause solution I originally brought up when we were talking in VC, but you were primarily focused on magic power etc.

That said, I fundamentally agree with everything you posted here, but I don't think we need a reset to implement these changes:

- If the current items in the game are not kept as BiS and new bosses are added with insanely low drop rates with new BiS, that is another way to address the problem. In this scenario, skele+whip etc. moves to mid level gear and it's totally fine if they aren't overwhelmingly rare.

- Of course the even better solution is the player base 5xing over night, which also solves all of these issues automatically.

The core success of any RSPS comes down to 1) player count, 2) player count, 3) player count --------> 4-5) rare items and the overall community(forums w drama etc.).

 

[Scott]

Someone just make a catchy tiktok to get the zoomers in problem solved.

 

[Mark Rutte]

I want to express my gratitude for your responses regarding this topic. However, I kindly request Luma, Kyle, and SeaJae to share their insights and perspectives instead of simply declining with a smiley emoji or a simple "no". It would be greatly appreciated if we could engage in a more meaningful discussion.

This morning, I noticed that their were only five individuals online, this situation concerns me, as it highlights a growing issue we face in 2023 compared to 2007—maintaining and attracting new members to our community.

While we have a solid foundation, it has become increasingly challenging to bring in new individuals and retain their interest. I believe it is essential for us to address this matter collectively and explore potential solutions together.

 

[Kyle]

Why ruin someone's experience of have one account as a skiller and one account as a combat account? it does not hurt the game or experience for other players. Imposing limits on anything will just cause people to bet upset and not want to play at all. I don't see how this would have any actual benefits to longevity of the server. Seems a little ridiculous imo.

 

[robosapian]

How obtuse of you to assume Dodian needs such drastic changes, it's going to be an obvious NO. We need more players to have a healthier economy, proper advertising, etc.

 

[Snook]

I think over limiting the current player base would just drive more people away than anything. I think the current issue is how to obtain new players and appeal to a different audience that has never experienced dodian back in its prime.

 

[Darkwolf]

Dodian needs to be advertised to attract more players. Word of mouth will be too slow. I agree with the viral TikTok to get peoples attention or even posting on some well known forums. If there was some type of fundraiser for advertising Dodian to attract new players I'd definitely donate.

 

[Mark Rutte]

Why ruin someone's experience of have one account as a skiller and one account as a combat account? it does not hurt the game or experience for other players. Imposing limits on anything will just cause people to bet upset and not want to play at all. I don't see how this would have any actual benefits to longevity of the server. Seems a little ridiculous imo.

Hi Kyle,

Unfortunately, it seems that the majority of players have two main accounts- one at warlord and another at nechyrael. I find this situation detrimental to the server as a whole. It primarely benefits individuals who hoard items and amass wealth, making it virtually impossible for new players to compete against these dual-account holders.

Moreover, due to our small community, there is a lack of active trading, making it seemingly impossible for new accounts to aquire better items. This lack of perspective and opportunity diminishes the enthusiasm of new players, as I witnessed with two of my friends.

By implementing measures to discourage or limit the use of multiple main accounts, we can promote fair competition and encourage trading within our community.

Anyway, thanks for considering my perspective on this matter guys.

 

[Luma]

Hi Kyle,

Unfortunately, it seems that the majority of players have two main accounts- one at warlord and another at nechyrael. I find this situation detrimental to the server as a whole. It primarely benefits individuals who hoard items and amass wealth, making it virtually impossible for new players to compete against these dual-account holders.

Moreover, due to our small community, there is a lack of active trading, making it seemingly impossible for new accounts to aquire better items. This lack of perspective and opportunity diminishes the enthusiasm of new players, as I witnessed with two of my friends.

By implementing measures to discourage or limit the use of multiple main accounts, we can promote fair competition and encourage trading within our community.

Anyway, thanks for considering my perspective on this matter guys.

Edited Comment

 

[Scott]

I think over limiting the current player base would just drive more people away than anything. I think the current issue is how to obtain new players and appeal to a different audience that has never experienced dodian back in its prime.

Exactly, put it this way. RSPS has been dying for awhile. But, OSRS is still quite relevant as ever. There is many players of OSRS who haven't ever tapped into RSPS. Mainly, newer players most likely. Hense why I recommend a viral video attemp or using social media platforms. Could be a serious way to lure people in. I realize we won't get much of anything out of the current RSPS pool. We literally have to bring people into RSPS from completely outside of it. Atleast that's the only way I see getting some massive gains. I also had the idea of working with Twitch streamers. Imagine we had a popular streamer who played. That would bring in many most likely a completely new experience for them. Just some ideas anyways!

TIKTOK funny meme vids
Tiktok adverts
Partner with twitch streamers

 

[Dashboard]

I don't think completely new players will have the patience to learn Dodian's quirks or value its progression. There are a million other games and servers that are better at retaining new people than we are able to. Advertising will get us clicks and sign ups, but will the people really stick around for this museum relic?

Honestly I completely expect Dodian to be on the fringe of death in 2023. It's amazing that we're still here.

--

Perhaps it'd be better for more players to have a chance at bosses, but it's a game, and people like winning.
Why is it that new players really need BIS weapons after 2 weeks? There's just not much content. Dodian is flawed.

--

Expect this to last a few months and die. You can't fix it. If you fix it, it's not Dodian any more.

 

[Nozemi]

I don't think completely new players will have the patience to learn Dodian's quirks or value its progression. There are a million other games and servers that are better at retaining new people than we are able to. Advertising will get us clicks and sign ups, but will the people really stick around for this museum relic?

Yes, 100%! People will be like "Oh, Dodian! That's a name I haven't seen it a while!" or "Oh, a new RSPS, let's check this out! ...(some time later) Hell the fuck no, what the fuck is this nonsense!? DreamScape is so much better, I like my rainbow dildo swords and rainbow Torva!!"

Dodian is not up to par with the general RSPS these days, so advertising right now will probably be counter effective. It will only sour the potential players even more, so the next time they see it, even with a lot of changes, it'll be a huge "HELL NO, NOT THAT SHIT AGAIN!" and it'll be a lot harder to regain their interest.

By restricting to a single account, we would ensure a more balanced distribution of resources and also create a more welcoming environment for our new players. At present, the dominance of multiple-account players at bosses, often with better gear on their alts than a new player could acquire in a week, can be disheartening for newcomers. In fact, I've witnessed two of my friends leave the server due to this issue, with being @DeMol27 the last one.

In the past we usually allowed 2 accounts per player. Where only one of them were allowed to be bossing. Single account limit won't really solve the bossing problem in Dodian. This problem has always been a problem, and probably will always be.

Maybe introduce instanced bosses? Maybe multi-player bosses where all participants roll for a drop (similar to how WoW does it)?

The other problem with Dodian was always skilling being so dead ass boring. There is no real purpose to lots of the skilling content in Dodian. Such as Smithing for example, nobody really needs any of the stuff that comes from it, other than arrows I guess. So making more content for skillers that feels more worthwhile and rewarding, could perhaps help motivate people to not only focus on bossing.

Additionally, I'd like to express my concern about the rapid accumulation of high-level gear in our server, which is not even two weeks old. For instance, @SuggySean has already acquired four SS, and I myself have max melee gear. If this trend continues, we may find ourselves handing out full skeleton sets to new players in a couple of weeks.

To address this, I propose implementing a daily cap on bosskills. This would ensure a fair opportunity for all players to participate, and slow down the rapid inflation of high-tier items by one player. As our player base grows, we can reassess and potentially lift these restrictions.

I'm not sure a daily cap on boss kills is the way to go. However, if each player get to kill a boss X amount of times per day, it would give some room for less geared players to also partake, but it will also drive away the people who grind these bosses.


Making bosses harder to kill, requiring you to actually go back to bank and grab more food, stay on top with pots, require prayer to be charged, etc. will help.

The other thing that can be done is to require some sort of fee, ticket, item, etc. to enter the boss lair, and/or increase the respawn time for these bosses. For example have them respawn after an hour or so.

Drop rates could probably also need to be looked over and tweaked a bit.

Nah people are leaving because of dickheads like you that have all the items but still camps bosses due to greed. Shit player, shit ideas.

You're not wrong, but also not entirely right. What else is there to do on Dodian? Dodian has always been about hoarding items, and then cleaning player banks through staking.

 

[Nozemi]

Again, the issue is you are playing a 300+ player designed server with about 20 people.

The entire server needs to be redone to keep the dodian feel, but at the same time adjust to the lower playerbase.

This is probably quite accurate, and I agree.

The issue is, it's already too late to implement this and "fix" the server. As you said yourself. The server is two weeks in and you have max melee, there are multiple sets of max melee gear ingame. If this is increased, no players will never have a chance. Last time I proposed a reset I was laughed at, but unfortunetly there is no other way.

Not necessarily true. These people will need incentive to distribute these items. New players needs to be attracted to make it less oversaturated. Alternatively an item sink so items actually circulate in the economy.

A reset is rarely the way to go about fixing a problem. Because it's very likely to run back into a similar state again anyway.

Make all drops more rare by at least 400%.

If not 400%, at least adjust the drop rates. Additionally, there probably needs to be mechanics in play to make it more easy for more players to have a go at the bosses. So the same few players can't camp these bosses all day and hoard all the good loot from them, and thus also control the economy on these items.

Make GP the main currency (add a trading post ingame).

Probably not a bad idea. Some kind of GE or trading post is probably a nice addition for people to trade between different timezones or schedules. If it's instead of a trading post, made like an auction system, you can set a minimum price, and have everything be auctioned off, so people can actually bid on items this way too.

Then people can look at previous auctions and see a price history for certain items as well. Which is a nice added bonus. Which also means regular trades don't have to be made public.

 

[Rembrandt]

This is probably quite accurate, and I agree.


Not necessarily true. These people will need incentive to distribute these items. New players needs to be attracted to make it less oversaturated. Alternatively an item sink so items actually circulate in the economy.

A reset is rarely the way to go about fixing a problem. Because it's very likely to run back into a similar state again anyway.


If not 400%, at least adjust the drop rates. Additionally, there probably needs to be mechanics in play to make it more easy for more players to have a go at the bosses. So the same few players can't camp these bosses all day and hoard all the good loot from them, and thus also control the economy on these items.


Probably not a bad idea. Some kind of GE or trading post is probably a nice addition for people to trade between different timezones or schedules. If it's instead of a trading post, made like an auction system, you can set a minimum price, and have everything be auctioned off, so people can actually bid on items this way too.

Then people can look at previous auctions and see a price history for certain items as well. Which is a nice added bonus. Which also means regular trades don't have to be made public.

This comment sums up how I feel about this as well. I also agree that the current game mechanics should be adjusted to fit the current size of our community, but I'm not sure lowering drop rates would do the trick. All that does is slow down wealth generated by players. By all of them, including the ones that are currently trailing. It doesn't solve the underlying issue that a select group of players is currently able to gatekeep the server's valuables. For as long as those valuables remain valuable. As @Plasma already said, rare items will not be rare anymore and will be replaced by new rares eventually as new content is added. I agree. However, I think there's a more subtle problem rooted in what @Mark Rutte describes and I understand his concerns.

The underlying thought is that the vast majority of wealth and 'the economy' - although one might argue that there is hardly an economy - is controlled by high combat players that are able to collect all loot and buy their way to max level. That in itself isn't necessarily an issue, it's inherently part of every MMORPG.

However, the current situation becomes more of an issue when new players aren't incentivized to level up, grind and compete even for mid-tier items. As it currently stands, it's nearly impossible to compete for bosses below combat level 100. People have already told me they quit simply due to the imbalance and hoarding behavior. One could argue that it's always been part of Dodian, that it's basically survival of the fittest and that people who do not have the patience to grind have no place here anyway. All of those arguments are valid. Still, I believe the current situation is detrimental for the server's growth potential. I fear more people will untimately quit frustrated and I doubt if the influx of new players will be able to counter the outflow.

We wouldn't be having this discussion if we had a 100+ active player base. The imbalance in wealth wouldn't be an issue and all of us would accept the fact that there's a select few wealthy players and a huge middle class. That being said, this isn't 2007 anymore and I believe the current server mechanics need some reworking to limit the gatekeeping behavior of the powerful few. Not because players aren't able to grind and eventually compete themselves, but because they won't.

@Dashboard said it perfectly:

I don't think completely new players will have the patience to learn Dodian's quirks or value its progression. There are a million other games and servers that are better at retaining new people than we are able to. Advertising will get us clicks and sign ups, but will the people really stick around for this museum relic?

I'm glad to see that some decent suggestions have already been proposed. We may very well be on the fringe of death, but we'd be screwed either way if we didn't try and improve things. In general, I think proposals that lead to equality of opportunity will benefit the server and it's players. Solutions that lead to equality of outcome will have an opposite effect.

 

[Nozemi]

but I'm not sure lowering drop rates would do the trick

Yeah, it won't, but it's a start - it'll buy some time, and probably be making it a little more worthwhile to get these drops when you actually do get them.